Tanya:

All right. So I have with me today, Dr. Karlie, she is a chiropractor. She is a mom. She is a pregnancy and postpartum athleticism coach, which like makes me so happy because there aren't that many of us in the whole world. And to boot, there aren't that many of us that are clinical professionals in some other way. And I think that that's really cool. So we're definitely gonna talk about this, but the other thing about her is that she has this really cool company called Jen and Carrie, and they make athletic wear for lactating people. And I'm so excited about what she's doing. I've actually been following her since, before we connected, because, you know, I guess I got wind of what was going on with your company launching you know, you definitely speak to CrossFitters, so that's how I kind of caught on. Yes. And then we like kind of magically connected and I was kind of excited about that. So we're gonna hear all about this. We're gonna talk a little bit about everything that I just mentioned as we kind of unpack this episode. So Dr. Carly, thank you so much for being here with me today.

Karlie:

Yeah. Thanks so much for having me. I'm so excited. We have so many things to talk about.

Tanya:

<Laugh> yes, we do. Okay. I would love to get started with a little bit of an introduction. One of the things I'd really like to know is a little bit about your athletic background. I wanna know a little bit about how and why you became a chiropractor, cuz you know, kind of like me as a midwife, I think we're sort of minority healthcare professions mm-hmm <affirmative> and then, you know, I'm sure you are having a baby kind of figures into that. And of course I wanna know about your entrepreneurship, but we'll unpack all of that a bit later as well. So just tell us what you think we need to know to get started.

Karlie:

Sure. Yeah. So my athletic background is mostly in volleyball. I played volleyball all through college played beach volleyball after college to and so that was really where my love of sports started from. And I, I learned about chiropractic sports chiropractic specifically from my chiropractor who helped me through high school college, you know, getting through injuries and being able to continue playing and just really realized that that was a great way to help people to also tie in my love of strength and conditioning and working out and lifestyle and you know, wellness and fitness and nutrition and all those pieces into helping people live a more healthy and active lifestyle. So that's kind of where that started. And then as I think it happens for a lot of people once, you know, we start thinking about maybe having kids or wanting to have babies or get pregnant.

I just really dove into the world of pregnancy and postpartum care and I just love it so much. You know, all the things that I do are really to empower women in those stages of life. And that really does encompass a lot of women, you know, they say up to 85% of women will have a child in their lifetime. And so that postpartum phase, as you know, we always say postpartum is forever. So it really just kind of started this like passion and fire in me. And, and I do that in a couple ways, right. I do it in my office in private practice. I do it online. I have you know, since COVID hit, I started an online rehab program that people can do after they've had their baby. And then, you know, most, probably new and exciting for me is the company, which we really just were.

We saw this need in the market for a sports bra specifically that just looked like a regular sports bra and didn't have the big ugly clips or zippers or buttons or, you know, that stuff that gets in the way and also is just like, you know, doesn't make you feel like yourself. You wanna feel like yourself after you have a baby. And, and so for me, that meant getting back in the gym. And so we were looking and looking, trying to find this, you know, the perfect nursing pumping sports bra, it didn't exist. So we had to create it. So that's been a really fun adventure too. So they all kind of tie together in just such a weird way, you know, but it's been really fun.

Tanya:

Yeah, that's really cool. And we are totally gonna talk about that some more, but first I wanna dive into a little bit about the you're being a chiropractor. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> I have a couple specific questions actually that I just thought of as you were introducing yourself, I heard you say something that I think was intentional. And if it is, I wanna know more about it <laugh> you said sports chiropractic. Yeah. And that leads me to believe that this is a very specific subset of chiropractic care that you focus or emphasize. And I just wanna know a little bit more about that, cuz I, myself am a big chiropractor fan, but yeah, this is new to me. Tell me more.

Karlie:

Yeah. Yeah. So the difference in a sports chiropractor it's actually a certification. I have a master's in human biology that also allowed me to sit for this sports chiropractic test. So you can look for there's, you know, you can look for it's called CCS P certified chiropractic sports physician. That's one and then there's also members of the ACA sports council. So both of those have just really great sports chiropractors. And what I mean by that is it's generally a chiropractor who focuses much more on not just the adjusting part of chiropractic, you know, what we call like the cracking really mm-hmm <affirmative> mm-hmm <affirmative> but they usually, and again, this is generally speaking spend more time. They're gonna look more at the muscles and the tissues and working on those muscles and tissues, knowing that the J the joints, the tissues, the tendons, the ligaments, everything is connected.

And then they're also going to spend more time doing rehab generally. So that's, that's usually what I recommend people look for. If we're talking about postpartum, I love for people to also find a chiropractor that does Webster. I'm sure you're familiar with, with that technique. And that's really specific to, you know, pregnancy and postpartum, but there are that we, we exist out there, sports chiros that also do Webster and yeah, I'm always happy to help connect people too, if they're looking for one of those docs. So people can always reach out to me and, and we have a big network, so we can say, oh yeah, I know. So and so in Scottsdale or San Diego or whatever, you know,

Tanya:

So while you're at it, can you tell us a little bit about what Webster is for our listeners?

Karlie:

Oh, sure. Yeah. So Webster, like I said is based for pregnancy pregnant patients, but we can use it on anyone. Really. The idea is just, we're trying to align the pelvis in the best possible way so that the baby has as much room to get into a good position for birth as possible. So when we think about how the, the pelvic bones work some people might have heard before, like, oh yeah, my, my right hip was rotated forward, or my left hip is, is stuck, you know, in whatever position. Sometimes these are words we use, like stuck inflection or extension. And so what we're trying to do is even them out and just, like I said, give the most room in the pelvis for the baby. And it's a, it's really light force technique. We use what's called a drop table.

And so what that means is we have the patient on a pregnancy pillow. So, which is also lovely when you're pregnant, you get to lay on your tummy with your belly in this, you know, kind of yum big hole. Yes. So nice. And then that allows us to have the patient in that prone position and we can check how their hips are moving and then we can do some really light force adjusting to get them to move better. And what I always tell people is, you know, it's, it's easy to get the pelvis to move in a pregnant patient, right. That's part of the problem because we're, it's so lax from all the relaxing in the system, right. That's what we want. We want the joints and everything to be able to stretch so that baby can come out. But we also, we, we want them to be in a good position.

So what I find too, and I always try to recommend people do is even if you're getting Webster, if you're getting adjusted, ask your chiropractor or PT or personal trainer, whoever you're working with, you want also some strengthening because the only thing holding that pelvis in a good position is the muscles, right. So we can get it moving. I can get it moving real easy for you. Get it perfectly aligned. But if you don't do a little bit of strengthening after that, it's probably not gonna last very long. Right. Cuz everything is just moving so much. So

Tanya:

Yeah. I mean, look, even if I have one complaint about chiropractic care, it's that I feel like I get addicted to it because the effects don't last forever. There's nothing that does. Right. So I can only imagine based on what you're saying, that that's more profound in pregnancy. So another thought is that well, something I wanted to share rather I realize as you were talking about Webster that I didn't actually know a ton about it because as a midwife, I tended to send people to Webster when they were breach and you know, I didn't, and obviously people who were experiencing various discomforts. Right. Of course I did that as well. And saying Webster to me was sort of synonymous with this person is knowledgeable about pregnancy, but I didn't actually know a ton about what made Webster Webster. I just knew that that was how I, as a midwife, could mildly vet someone, do you know

Karlie:

What I mean? Yeah. Yes. And, and I mean, it is funny because that is what Webster was originally known for, you know, and we're very careful to say, like we don't flip babies. That's not what we do, but sometimes if you get the pelvis in a good position and you can imagine, imagine if your right hip is rotated forward, severely a you're gonna have a lot more pulling the left hip is gonna probably rotate back. And so now you have kind this O bleak position that the baby's gonna get in. Well, if you can get that moving, you know, into so that it's more, even now that baby can get head down much easier. So so that is how it's known by a lot of, you know, practi like nurse midwives and even OBS is that if, if the baby's not flipping try that and it does often work, but it's not because we flip them it's because we mm-hmm, <affirmative> help the body to get into a good position. And then the baby kind of does when it's supposed to do.

Tanya:

Yeah. That's awesome. I love it. Okay. So, you know, this is making me think a little bit about the fact that we both have these kind of slightly marginal professions as we've already mentioned. And I know that for me as a midwife, one thing that I have to deal with at life is people not totally understanding what I do. Having some weird myths, not understanding that I actually have an education. I'm not a witch. Mm-Hmm, <affirmative> all those kinds of things. Right. <laugh> but I suspect and correct me if I'm wrong, that you deal with something sort of similar that being people express a lot of fear around chiropractic care sometimes. And that's something I really wanted to chat with you about because I commonly recommend chiropractors to pregnant and postpartum people. And I'm gonna go out on a limb and say 50% are game and 50% are like, hell no, <laugh>. And I don't know what stories they're hearing or where that's coming from. Yeah. But I would love it. If you would talk a little bit about why chiropractic care is so safe and kind of your experience of people asking you these questions right. To your face

Karlie:

<Laugh> yeah. Yeah. It is a question we get a lot, it's sort of more of an old school way of thinking, you know another old school way of thinking is, you know, that PTs and chiropractors just don't get along and are at odds. And I find in my practice that that's not the case at all. One of my closest friends is a PT, you know? And so I think it's sort of an old way of thinking, and it's not, it's just not really understanding how the body works and just not understanding the history. And so I just always tell people a you wanna, you wanna see someone you trust. So I always recommend to have a re a recommendation or a referral from a friend or, or like I said, one of those online associations where people have gone through further education and they're a little bit more vetted in my opinion.

And, and then really, you know, we do all the orthopedic tests that you would have done. Let's say that your neck hurts and you go to an orthopedic doctor, we're going to do all of those same tests, same thing for the shoulder, same thing for the knee, same thing for the low back, we learn all the same tests. We actually spend more time in anatomy labs than medical students do. And so we have a really good understanding of, of the muscles and the tissues and the bones and the nerves and the joints and how everything works together. And so so we're doing those tests. We're making sure that a it's safe to adjust you B you need to be adjusted because there are many times where I'm like, this is a soft tissue thing. Actually the joints are moving pretty good and we don't need to adjust them.

And then you also wanna see someone that's open to maybe not adjusting in a certain way. So I have plenty of patience that for whatever reason, they're nervous about their neck being adjusted. Fine. I don't need to adjust your neck. I can work on the muscles. I can do give you some contract, relaxed, stretches. There's so many things that we can do. And I think if you're seeing someone that has that mentality, then that's a pretty good way to go because you don't want someone who only has, you know, one tool in their pocket. And then if that tool, if you're not comfortable with that, then you're Sol, you know, so that's, that's, those are some of the recommendations that I make when people are looking for a chiropractor and maybe are a little bit nervous.

Tanya:

Have you ever had a patient who comes to you and says outright, like I'm coming to you because I'm desperate, but I am kind of scared. Is there a particular patient that comes to mind that you could tell us a little story about?

Karlie:

<Laugh>I mean, we see those patients a lot. Our practice here, I'm in Seattle and my practice is Seattle sports chiropractic. And my partner has been in practice for 26 years, I think. And I've been in practice. This is my 12th year. And so we get a lot of referrals of people that have done everything. And I guess specifically a few that I think of, there are some medical doctors that I've had that are just like, you know, I'm sort of their last hope and they really didn't want to come. And then we talk through, okay, here's, here's what I'm actually doing. Here's what it looks like. And, and fortunately, some of those people are like the biggest believers and advocates for chiropractic after they learn what it is and become more comfortable with it. You know,

Tanya:

Isn't it interesting though, you know, that someone who comes from a different modality they're so schooled in that modality that they really have to have a personal experience with it in order to have that big wake up call to realize that this can be valuable in my clients or patients' lives as well. For

Karlie:

Sure. Oh yeah.

Tanya:

You know, something that you said that I wanna unpack just a tiny bit more is you said in terms of your assessment that you're checking to see if it's safe to have an adjustment. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> what are some of the reasons that it might not be safe? Because I, to totally gloss over this with people because I trust chiropractors and I'm like, adjustments are safe, but of course, right. I'm not the person having to decide who it's safe for and who it's not. So what are some of the reasons it might not be right?

Karlie:

So the main things we're looking for are, you know, we're doing all the neurological testing to make sure that there's not like a big old disc herniation in there that we could potentially not necessarily make the disc herniation work, but worse, but maybe make the symptoms a little bit worse. And so so those are the tests that we're doing in the neck. We're doing tests to make sure that there's no issue with the vertebral artery, which, which truly is what most people are afraid of. People have heard that, you know, you can have a stroke from having your neck adjusted, but the reality is you're way more likely to have a stroke just going to your doctor's office, if you have neck pain being in your hairdresser's chair, leaning back there's all kinds of things that actually way more likely to happen than having a, a neck adjustment.

And so those, I think that's the thing that is like, you know, and the movies perpetuate that, right? Like people are like breaking people's necks in the movies. Like I'm definitely, I do not have that skill. I'm not strong enough to break your neck, you know, by adjusting it, it's such a light force movement. And so I think as long as those tests are being done and, you know, we are of course also listening to history and the red flags and all that stuff. That's what we go to school for. You know, the adjusting is easy. What a chiropractor's train in is when not to adjust someone. And so that's the piece that I think most people don't understand. And and don't understand that we go to school for four years after our undergrad for this profession. Right. So we're eight years in. I have a master's also, so there's, you know, there's just a ton of education around it. And and it is, it is safe for, you know, 99.9% of the population.

Tanya:

Yeah. And also even, you know, when we're talking about the risk of strokes and the general population, when you brought up the different scenarios where it's more common. Yeah. Think another thing people have a really hard time with is sort of the relative frequency that something's happening. Right. So what are the odds that you're actually gonna have a stroke at the hairdresser? Right, right. It's, we're, it's close to zero. <Laugh> right. Not zero, but close to zero. Right. So we're talking really rare things. Totally. And I find that clients, especially during pregnancy and postpartum, when our anxieties ramp up for really valid reasons, we have a really hard time making sense outta those things. And we start to fear things that are extremely rare. So I find myself saying things like, you're more likely to get hit by a brick walking under that scaffolding in New York city. Totally like that, that doesn't worry you. Right. Like, right. <Laugh>,

Karlie:

You're more likely make people up. I know one of the stats is you're more likely to get hit by lightning also than have a stroke from a chiropractor. You know, it's just, it's so rare. But that being said, I also like want to take people's concerns into, you know, consideration. So I always, you know, especially with pregnant patients, if the neck is not specifically bothering them and they're having, you know, a lot of upper back pain, which is very common during pregnancy, you know, as the chest grows and the belly's pulling you forward, then we can adjust the upper back. And that is like, that's probably the, a bigger lifesaver, you know, anyways for a pregnant person, the pelvis, like those areas just need so much attention that if you have any concern about the neck, like it's not my job to talk you into it. It's my job to tell you, you know, here's what we could do potentially you'd feel much better if I did this adjustment, but, you know, we could probably get you 75% the way there just by working on the muscles and giving you some exercises. So I think every chiropractor, every PT has a different way of doing things. Of course, you know, different styles. But I think as long as you find someone that's willing to talk you through things and listen to you, that's, what's most important.

Tanya:

Yeah. And I mean, if I'm honest, I get nervous every time we get to the neck cracking part, but I know how amazing I feel after that. And I just like, kind of have to talk myself through some slow, deep breaths. My chiropractor always has to like, do a tiny bit of distraction with me, catch me just a tiny bit off guard. So I relax. Yeah. And then I'm so grateful that I did it, but I understand that people are nervous. But anyway, I, I hope that what you just unpacked for us will help people be a little more open minded to the possibility that this could be a really important tool in their tool bag. So with that said, let's talk a little bit more about what some of the things are that you can treat in pregnant people. You know, I know that there's a million things, so maybe we'll focus on a few that are the most profound.

Karlie:

Yeah. Yeah. I think there's a couple things that come to mind that it just makes me so sad that they, during pregnancy maybe don't realize that they could have help with, and one is low back pain and pelvic pain, you know? I think unfortunately a lot of people just assume that that is the norm that you're gaining weight, your body's changing, your ligaments are stretching all that stuff. And that it's, it's normal to have low back pain. And it's not, it's not normal. It's very common, but it's not normal. And there's so many things that can be done to help. As far as exercises adjustments stretches, you know, even muscle work can go a long ways. Having massage can be super helpful. So that's one of, probably the most common one. Again, I mentioned upper back pain as the chest grows and in nursing, especially and obviously I'm passionate about helping nursing and pumping moms, you know, I started a whole company to do it better.

Right. So I just love helping with the upper back also because it's, it's something people don't expect, they expect their low back to hurt, but the neck and the upper back you know, when you think about the position you're in for nursing, you're really hunched forward. And then you're always looking down at the baby, right. Even if you're not nursing, if you're bottle feeding, you're just constantly looking down. And so people don't understand how bad their neck might start hurting during that postpartum time. So it's really rewarding to be able to help people with those few issues. And then I think the other surprising one, and I'm sure you're used to hearing this, but is either the, the mommy thumb or mommy wrist which comes from holding the baby a lot in that super flexed position. And it's just all the form flexes of the muscles shortening, tightening, cranking on the thumb pulling on the elbow sometimes too, and it can get pretty bad. So I like to start my patients with some wrist strengthening drills during pregnancy. So they get used to doing those and then in postpartum, they can continue with those. And that, that usually helps a lot too.

Tanya:

So I'm really happy that you just mentioned that because even I, as the midwife might not have thought to send my client to the chiropractor for that, because I think a little too narrowly about the spine. Right. So,

Karlie:

Yeah. And that's, I think, sorry, that's, that's where you, you really want someone who's working on the muscles. So you want a sports chiropractor. You want someone who potentially does active release technique, a RT, which is another, you know, thing that I tell people often to look for cuz they're going to address the muscles and the joints. And so, you know, just adjusting the wrist for that, isn't quite enough like the, the actual muscles need to be worked on too. And that could be done by a massage therapist also. But that is one of the big ones that I think really catches people off guard, you know, their thumb can get so, so painful. And the elbow too, you know, and especially if they're doing any bed sharing, you know, they often end up with that arm kind of curled around the baby, but just even caring and holding the baby can, can create that too.

Tanya:

So a modality you just mentioned, I think you said a R T

Karlie:

Yeah, it's called active release technique and it's it's a therapy that's a chiropractors PTs massage therapists. I think even personal trainers in some states can do it now. And it's just basically a very specific muscle work technique where we're getting in and making sure that things are kind of sliding and gliding between the muscles, the tendons, all that stuff.

Tanya:

That sounds really delicious actually. Yeah. The second it can be sliding and gliding. I'm like, I need more of that in my body. <Laugh>

Karlie:

It can be a little, like I tell people it's sort of the good pain, you know, it's like, ah, this like doesn't feel awesome, but I know it's gonna feel so much better when it's done. So yeah.

Tanya:

Yeah. I call that the good hurt <laugh>. Yes, exactly. Awesome. So, okay. We talked a little bit about, you know, what kinds of things you can treat in pregnancy, but what about postpartum? Because I think that's a huge gap. I do not think people are thinking about chiropractors for most common postpartum complaints.

Karlie:

Yeah. And unfortunately I think that's the case, but it's also because they're so tired and overwhelmed and they're so like a whole new world going on, you know? So I like to have my patients start with me during pregnancy and then I always tell them, you know, give yourself a little time after the baby comes. But around like the four week mark three to four weeks is when I like to see them. And it also always recommend they check in with a pelvic floor PT because we can just work so well together. As a public floor PT and a sports chiropractor is like such a great team to have. And I like people to have that set up before they have the baby, because afterwards, like I said, there's just too much going on. Like I always just say, get everything set up. You can before, you know, whatever your plan is for rehab, whatever your plan is for self care, get used to that and get it set up beforehand, because then you will be like delightfully surprised at three weeks that you booked yourself a massage or whatever it is, you know, after the baby comes.

Tanya:

So one of my guests, a few weeks ago, Rachel mass, she is a midwife and she is also a pregnancy and postpartum athleticism coach. She told us her birth story and she talked about how she had her chiropractor come over hours after birth and work on both her and her baby. What are your thoughts? We did not unpack that in that episode, but it really stuck out to me as a unique experience that not many people do. Do you have thoughts about that timeframe?

Karlie:

Yeah. I mean, I think if everyone had that ability, that would be amazing, you know? That's not always the case. Very few are fortunate enough to have that, but yeah, I think the sooner you can get things moving the better. I always, I always tell people, you know, once it, of course, things can always be improved later, right. But it's just like spraining your ankle. If I can adjust your ankle almost immediately, it will feel so much better and so much less time. Then if you try to like deal with it for four weeks and then you come in now we've got scar tissue. Now we've got, you know, changes in movement patterns. We've got all these other issues to deal with. So it's sort of similar on a much different, you know, playing field with pregnancy. Your body goes through a traumatic experience and arguably the most athletic experience that you ever go through. So to have someone to help right away, I think is unbelievable. That'd be great. <Laugh>

Tanya:

Okay. So, so back to what things are common in postpartum that you can actually treat. So I guess I'm curious about things like the interface with pelvic floor concern mm-hmm <affirmative> so I think something our listeners are starting to become more aware of is that there's a bigger relationship, right? Whatever's going on under your pelvic floor. It's not isolated to your pelvic floor. Right. So I can understand why you have a role in this, but can you unpack that just a bit more?

Karlie:

Yeah, for sure. So like you said, the pelvic floor, when we think about our core, right? Our core is roughly the top is the diaphragm, the bottoms of the pelvic floor. And then we have all the muscles kind of in the barrel around. So we think about it as this big barrel, right? One thing people often forget is the glutes are a big part of the, what goes on with the pelvic floor. So when we start strengthening the glutes, that actually does also help strengthen the pelvic floor. So it's things like that, that if you're seeing a chiropractor who does exercise and rehab and that sort of stuff too, or PT or whoever you're working with that they cannot only get the SI joints moving in a good you know, with a good movement patterns, but then they can help you stabilize in that position, start using your glutes, which is going to help strengthen the pelvic floor, teach you breathing techniques, all that sort of stuff.

So to answer your question about what can be treated all basically all the aches and complaints, you know, anything with the low back the neck, the upper back and even foot pain is a common one, you know, because the everything has spread right. All the we've gained weight. So there's more strain on our feet. The ligaments have also loosened, right, because that relaxant works on the whole system, not just on the pelvic floor and on the pelvis. And so that's a big one too, is just sort of, re-engaging learning how to strengthen the feet, use the feet, the kind of intrinsic foot muscles so that we don't have problems with plant fascia pain, that sort of thing. So I always just recommend really everyone, if they could, I would love for them to see a chiropractor and a PT in that postpartum phase, because when we go to our six week checkup, realistically, there's not a lot of like evaluation of these other areas. You know, there's a few, most, most six week checkups are a few questions, not usually a physical exam. And then, okay, well you're cleared for exercise. Well, you didn't look at my, my feet, my ankles, my knees, my hips, my shoulders, my low back. You didn't look at all these things. And so no fault to the OBS or the midwives or whoever you're having that checkup with, but there's someone else who can do yeah. That physical checkup and it is a physical therapist or a chiropractor. So

Tanya:

100%. I love it. Okay. I have one more question for you, but then I do wanna talk to you about your company a bit. Yeah. <laugh> so my, my last question kind of on this note is how much of everything that you have been talking to me about today has been informed by your becoming a pregnancy and postpartum athleticism coach. Would you say that everything you're talking about you came into this knowing, or is this a big evolution for you?

Karlie:

Yeah, that's a great question. So there I learned a, a lot from the pregnancy and postpartum athleticism course, and I am so grateful for it. But I, like, you had another background already with some of this information. Right. And so I find that they go very well together. They work very well together and I'm super grateful that to have that understanding, but yeah, I think, I think I had some of it and then I started learning it or thinking about it maybe a little bit more realistically, or like in the real world by doing that certification.

Tanya:

Hmm, cool. Ed, do you bring it into the office with you in terms of oh

Karlie:

Yeah, totally.

Tanya:

Okay. I think mean that, that seems like a given

Karlie:

<Laugh>. Yeah. Like, like the piston breathing, you know, that's something that I was, you know, and I also, I do CrossFit, I'm a weightlifter. So like, I, I knew that breathing technique, but it had never been explained to me, you know, in my master, in my doctorate. Like here's why we do it. And I think that's one thing that I am so grateful for understanding better, the piston breathing technique, you know, which is a way that we breathe while we're doing exercise to help protect the pelvic floor. And just make sure we're not putting additional strain on it. That's unnecessary. That's like a small example of something that I use clinically every day that we didn't learn that, that way in chiropractic school at all. So that was that's, that's a huge game changer for me. Some things like that.

Tanya:

Cool. And for our listeners, I will put something in the show notes about piston breathing so that you're not totally left in the dark. It would be a longer conversation than we have time for. So okay. Let's talk about your company. Your company is called Jen and Carrie. And yet your name is Carly and your partner's name is Jess what's going on there? Yes.

Karlie:

Yeah. <Laugh> so once we started like I was mentioning earlier researching these sports bras and it really started with me complaining to her, like Jess is one of my closest friends and I was like, dude, I just wanna work out. I don't want these clips. They're so ugly. I hate all the sports bras out there. And she's like a very good researcher. And so she's like on the internet trying to find me this bra, you know, so anyways, we started creating the bra and we're cutting up old bras and seeing like, okay, we could do this and how could we make it? So there doesn't have to be any clips or anything like that. So, you know, then we've, we've got our prototype and we're moving down the process and we're like, okay, well we need like a company name. Right. So anyways, we just decided, yeah, like you said, her name is Jess. My name is Carly and notoriously people call us the wrong names. They're always calling her Jen. They're always calling me Carrie. And so we're like, yes, Jen and Carrie are like, they're like, you're cool mom, friends who like, know all the dets on, you know, all the cool gear you need to get back into working out and all the things <laugh>,

Tanya:

It's your alter ego.

Karlie:

It's our, yes. It's our alter egos. That's sure. Yeah. <laugh> so, yeah, so that's how that was born. And we just, we spent so long, you know, perfecting this bra, like trying to find the right material to make sure it's soft, but compressive. And, and that was our goal is to create a bra that's compressive enough for high level athletics for jumping, for running, for weight, lifting, you know, all these things and, but still comfortable enough, you know, that you can wear it. Well, if you wear a bigger size, you can wear it for a longer period of time. We really did make it so that it's not meant to be made or it's not made to be worn all day. It's for that high compressive, you know, workout, but we're working on a few others now that are more of like an all day bra and sort of like a less compressive version. But of course, you know, everything takes longer than you want it to. So, but someday, eventually it'll be out there.

Tanya:

<Laugh> so I got a question for you. Yeah. How does your bra work when it comes to people of different size breasts? Because we have really different needs, like, you know, yes. I personally barely need a sports bra period. And so I have a really hard time when my clients are, are large breasted and in need. Yep. I haven't intuitively been great at making those recommendations

Karlie:

<Laugh> yeah. Yeah. So it is interesting because that's one thing we found is that during the pregnancy and into the postpartum phase, women can usually wear two sizes. So like, I, for example, I can actually almost wear three. So what, before I could wear a small and now I can wear a small, again, I'm about five months postpartum now. While I was pregnant, I could wear a medium and I could even wear a large if I wanted to like wear it all day, you know? And so it's just kind of understanding, okay, what, what do you wanna wear the bra for? Do you wanna just wear it for an hour in the gym, then we want it probably to be fairly compressive. And then also understand, you know, the breasts get more, more engorged right after, you know, initially, and then usually kind of calm down after that.

And so there are usually a few sizes people can wear and we did design the bra so that it can be worn after you're done nursing too. So it was kind of funny. We, when we were, you know, having people test the bra out to see what they thought, we had some friends wear it to play beach volleyball in, and that are not moms and have never been pregnant. And they were sort of confused because they were like, this just like, looks like a regular sports bra. Like what? And we're like, yes, that's what we wanted. Like, we want you to not be able to tell and it's because there's no clips and you, you pull up the top layer, you pull down the bottom layer and and we've had some great feedback like that. We've had, you know, moms, nurse twins. We've had, you know, people at the end of a marathon nursing their baby at CrossFit competitions. So it's been super cool to just see some of those, like actually it in action at the pool we had people sending us pictures this summer, they're wearing it as like a, a bathing suit top. So nice. Yeah, it's been super fun just to see what people are doing and, and that it's actually working, you

Tanya:

Know, can you get both breasts out at the same time? Can you put a double pump in, can you put a pump that's portable in all the things?

Karlie:

Yeah. Yeah. So we actually did change the design after our first round to be a little bit easier to get both breasts out if you need it's a little bit tight, you know, to have both all the way out. Right. Because it's still, we're trying, like, it's an

Tanya:

Impressive bra. It's kind of like a little bit of an oxymoron, like how be compressive and get both breast out. So

Karlie:

I get it. Yes. Yeah, exactly. So you can, that is definitely a little bit harder, but one breast is, you know, pretty is very easy. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> and then the pumps, so it is set up so you can use, you know, any kind of pump with it, because that was super important to us to be able to support, not just nursing moms, but people who are pumping too. And I, I, it's funny cause I started using those like pod pumps this time, you know, like the, I don't know, I have a knockoff one, but like the LV or whatever they're called. Yeah. And I was like, oh, I don't need like to wear my bra for this, but actually it compresses it to my breast a little bit more. And so I get a little bit more milk that comes out as opposed to just using like a regular, like a little bit looser bra. So there's stuff like that, that we like keep kind of discovering and we're like, oh, that's cool. <Laugh>

Tanya:

Okay. So I, I get that. The main difference is the lack of snaps and annoying things. Right. But what, is there anything else that sets you apart from competitors? Be it the technology that you're using, the materials you're using, how you're sourcing materials, things like that.

Karlie:

Yeah. Yes. Yeah, for sure. So we're using recycled materials, which was super important to us. And we also produce at a factory in Mexico, which is female owned. So that was also important to us. And we, I mean, we, we tested a lot of fabrics trying to find something that was soft and like you know, we've had a people describe it as like buttery, you know, like we really, that was important to us and then trying to figure out, okay, how do we still make that compressive? So we do have a mesh layer in there. So there's all these pieces that, I mean, it took a long time to, to make it just how we want it. And we're a small company, so I'm sure, you know, maybe a bigger company could have whipped it out a lot faster, but but it's, it was just, it was like our baby, you know, so we just wanted everything to, to be just right before we, we got it out to people.

Tanya:

Do you have different designs? Like what does it look like for our listeners who are trying to picture this?

Karlie:

Yeah, yeah. So currently we have just two colors. We have black and gray like a nice deep charcoal, gray and we are, we're planning other colors also. But right now we just wanted to start with the basic, you know, kind of like, what do you want every day? You know, that you could wear every day and not get tired of it. So eventually we'll have more colors. We'd love to have some patterns and a couple different designs. So we we've just been it's been a year almost since we've launched. So, you know, and there was like a year and a half, maybe two years before that of kind of planning and prepping and going over and over the design and changing this and that. And so so yeah, we're still super new, but we're really excited. So

Tanya:

Cool. And are these brass really for everyone or is it like we're really marketing to CrossFitters or like, how's

Karlie:

That? Yeah. Yeah. So our slogan is every mom is an athlete and we, we think of that in a couple different ways. One is we believe that you should be able to do whatever you wanna do as a mom, whatever you did before, if you're passionate about doing it still, whether it's running or jujitsu or tennis or whatever you wanna do, you know, we've seen, and it's been so beautiful, you know, in these last few years as these professional athletes come back and play their sports. And it's just so inspiring, you know, mm-hmm, <affirmative> so, so that's one piece of every mom as an athlete, but the second piece is moms are inherently athletic. So even if you don't think about yourself as an athlete, you are because you are picking up a 20 pound car seat, lifting it up, towing a toddler, carrying a coffee, you know, you're doing three diaper bags who knows there's so much going on.

And you know, when you think about, okay, when I, when I put my baby down in the crib, okay, well, that's a hip pinge or a deadlift, right? So you're doing an athletic movement. When you pick up the car seat and put into the car, you're basically doing in a little like slower motion, like a clean, right? Like you're doing a power clean basically. And so there's all these movements that even moms who maybe think, ah, I'm not, I'm not an athlete you are. And and we just wanna support, support that for, for women everywhere as they continue to do the things that they love and the things that make them feel like themselves.

Tanya:

I love it. That's so great. <Laugh> how much are your bras?

Karlie:

They're $68.

Tanya:

Not too bad. Not too bad as these things go. Yes. Alright. I got one more question for you before we wrap up. Yeah. If a new parent or a practitioner, both, right. We're talking to both audiences here is out there listening and they have a big idea and they don't know where to begin. What's the best piece of advice that you would give somebody to take their idea from that idea, stage to reality who wants to flex that entrepreneurial muscle?

Karlie:

Yeah. I think there are so many online courses and things that can help you with that. Now. we actually did a course called start and scale, which was pretty informative. And there's a lot of other things like that. That's just happens to be the one that we did because like neither of us came from a background of manufacturing, my partner, Jess and I she is a strength and conditioning coach and she has a background in marketing and I'm obviously a chiropractor and have a background also in like everything athletic and sports related. So there was, we had no idea like, okay, how do we get something produced? Like where do we even start? So I think just, you know, using the internet as your resource and researching and taking the time to, to learn and, you know, make connections goes a long ways. So

Tanya:

Totally. Yeah. I am so inspired by you and, but truly by all practitioners who have the guts to step out on the ledge and do the things that we weren't taught how to do in school. Yeah, so

Karlie:

I'm really, it's

Tanya:

A lot. It is, it's crazy, right. It's a crazy world and I'm meeting more and more people in this boat and really enjoying having these conversations. Thank you so much for taking the time to talk to me today.

Karlie:

Yeah. Thanks so much for having me. It was, it was a real pleasure.