Tanya Tringali

Hey everyone, I'm your midwife Tanya Tringali. Welcome to the mother wit podcast, a show about the issues we healthcare consumers and providers face every day as we interact with the medical system. We'll talk about its blind spots, shortcomings, and share strategies we can use to feel seen and heard no matter which side of the table we sit on.

Tanya Tringali

My guest today is Florence and Romano. She's the author of build your village, a guide to finding joy and community in every stage of life. A little bit about Florence, she was born and raised just outside of Chicago, where she spent more than 15 years as a childcare provider, during which time she was known as the Windy City nanny. I love that. Anyway, we talk a lot on this show about the particular village building that is specific to the perinatal period, and what it takes to survive and hopefully thrive in the early postpartum period. But I really wanted to have Florence and on because I really appreciate the way she translates the idea of needing a village to all stages of life. And I'm realizing that many of my clients have had second babies in this past year, I'm seeing second, third and even fourth birthdays on my Instagram feed with for those of you who keep in touch and are listening. So I appreciate that you are staying with me in this form of community. And I want to make sure that this episode really resonates with you as you change and grow. And I think this is also really relevant to our health care providers that are listening, who have often growing families as well and can benefit from this discussion as a means of preventing burnout, which is so huge in the very giving and loving work that we all do. So I digress as it pertains to introducing Florence and why she is such a badass. So Florence wears many hats that no doubt contribute to her unique perspective and expertise. In addition to being an author, she is a personal growth strategist, a philanthropist, a business woman. She is on the board of directors at the Children's Research Fund, and a nonprofit called female strong that provides programs and mentorship to middle and high school aged girls. And she is a founding member member of Sesame Street's Leadership Council, Florence. And thank you so much for taking the time to talk to me today.

Florence Ann

I'm so thrilled to be here, I shade the tomato here with your beautiful introduction there. And I'm just so excited to have this conversation. Because your your listeners really fall into such a special group of people that are going through a very interesting chapter of their lives where community and connection are paramount. And sometimes I think also, we forget how important to all that is during such a transitional time in their lives too.

Tanya Tringali

Absolutely. And I think there is a base of people, especially people who listen to the show, who know the importance of it for surviving the early days. But I think those communities often fall apart very quickly. And then we're left to try to recover that and figure out how to how to get it back. And I think that's what your book talks about. But before we dive in, I would love it if you would tell us a little bit more about yourself and how the book came to be and how you came to this kind of body of knowledge and becoming so passionate in this general idea.

Florence Ann

Right? Well, you had mentioned I had been a nanny for over 15 years in my life. So obviously, I've been sold out for kids for a long time. And I've wanted to, you know, be an advocate for families and children and all the different forms that they come in for a very long time. And then after I was no longer a nanny as Mary Poppins would say, you stay until the wind changes and the wind changed for a lot of different reasons at the time. But after I retired from being a nanny, I started a digital content company, and at the same time decided to write my first book. And that was a children's book to help children understand the transition of being cared for by their parents to being cared for by a nanny or caretaker. Because at the time, over 64% of families in America had a nanny or a caretaker or daycare, whatever it might be. And I thought gosh, that is a jarring statistic. It is not something that is indicating it is just a trend in our society. It's part of our culture. And we need to pay attention to this that it takes a community it takes a village and people are relying on other people to help them raise their children. And so after I wrote that book and and went out and did a lot of media and child care advocacy and things about at all regarding that COVID hit you know a few years later, and I started to kind of look around at the landscape of our lives and in a global way. We all knew what it felt like to go through something together in a global way. I'll say that again. Because that is so unique to, to our to COVID to our situation when going through a global pandemic like that. But the one common denominator we all had was that we knew what it felt like to lose our support systems. Where did everybody go, you know, we couldn't be with people anymore. You couldn't rely on child care, you couldn't rely on your community, or your village, or your tribe, or your girls or your guys the way you did before. And so now, I started thinking about that proverb, it takes a village to raise a child. And I thought, okay, yeah, that makes sense. That's true. But what about the people that don't have children? Don't they deserve to find their community to doesn't everybody does deserve to find their people. And so I wanted to write a book that answered that question that you hear moms specifically bemoan, you know, where's the phone number to the village, where are the directions to the village, where's the roadmap. And so I wanted to write that book and give the directions to the village. But I wanted it to be inclusive, I wanted everyone to feel like no matter what they were born into, where they were born, whatever their case may be, that they deserved to find their people and have that power within them to do that for themselves. And I wanted it to be a book that was relatable that you didn't like, pick up and think, gosh, you know, I'm not going to do any of this. This is way too hard. I wanted it to be something you could wrap your mind around, run your fingers through. So I created six archetypes of villagers that you identify with, who am I of these six people? And who do I need of these six people in my village? Because we all like to relate to something to feel like we can see ourselves in other people or in other things. We're visual learners in that way. So that created a space for me during COVID. To write build your village.

Tanya Tringali

Awesome. Well, You've piqued my interest. And I already want to know what the six villagers are.

Florence Ann

That's my favorite part is I'm gonna give you the six and I'm not even gonna give you a definition to attach to them. Because I'm not even gonna Okay, I'm not even gonna say it. I'm not gonna give you the definition attached. Because after I do, I want to see what your reaction is Tanya. So this six are accepting, dependable, communicator, cheerleader, organizer, and healer. Now I'm not I'm now the reason I didn't want to say anything or give a definition to them was because I was watching your face during it. And I could see that you already were starting to cast people in your life into those roles automatically, weren't you?

Tanya Tringali

I'm guessing that was happening. And it was also I was casting myself.

Florence Ann

Oh, yeah. Yeah.So who do you who just without a definition attached? Who do you think of those six, and you can be all six? You don't have to just choose one. But let's just for the sake for just, you know, the sake of this conversation? Yeah, out of those six did you identify with one of those six more?

Tanya Tringali

Well, the one that reached the top of the list was healer. By analogy here is, this is not about building a real real life village. It's a fictional situation. But for whatever reason, a thought that I have had many times in my life is, if there was ever a zombie apocalypse, I the only way I'm going to find a home of people to protect me because I wouldn't know how to protect myself is to say, I'll be the healer of the group, because it's historically always the midwife who has the broadest base skills to make sure that a group of people is taken care of. So I have always known like, that's what I have to give to a group and I have to pitch that idea hard, so that these other people will save my life.

Florence Ann

That's really a fabulous analogy, actually. And I would like to be with you if I need to be with you during that zombie apocalypse, I think I because you know, what you you really are in your line of work, you know, in your expertise, and how you show your love to the world. You know, the healer, at least in the definition that I give in the book is not the person that's there to fix you, or to fix the situation to fix all your problems. They're there to walk with you through it, whatever the it is, they're the North Star in your life and I can see from your energy, that that is exactly what you are and what you give to this world who you bring into this world how you create that space for that very majestic and magical moment for for these people. You know, that definitely lends itself to being the healer in so many different respects. And so I love that you were thinking Who am I of those six? And I always say, you know, as you do this work, as you figure out, you know who you are, and you know who who you need. It's important that we remember, I can't always be just about us. We have to step outside ourselves and live that life and service of others and figure out how do we show up for other people, because it actually is in showing up for other people that we learn so much about ourselves to, and what we need. And so it's this kind of circle, it's this, this this reciprocity that we have. But I'll tell you what, the hardest thing for people to do, I think next to public speaking, in this world, is asking for help. And that's what this is, this community building this connection, this this human connection, this is about being vulnerable. And it's about honesty. And that's not easy for people to do. So this work that I'm asking people to participate in, there is a number one over arching requirement to it. And that is you have to want it, I can't make you you can't make any we can't make anyone want this want to connect want to change this for themselves in their lives. But there comes a point I think, especially now in our world today, where mental health and emotional well being is suffering so much that we are starting to see people put this in the forefront of their minds,

Tanya Tringali

Well I think people deeply want to be wanted or needed. And yet we have such a hard time asking for it. But many times, people are thrilled that you did ask. And I have thats what.... And I'm listen, I'm as guilty as the next person when it comes to not being able to ask for help. We, I think that this is a very modern problem. And many of us have it, so I'm not excluding myself. But I'm almost always surprised. The way in which people step up for me when I need it. Even when I haven't even quite asked just by opening up people will come forward and start to fill roles or gaps, I suppose.

Florence Ann

Yes, fill the gaps. Yep, exactly. But, you know, mentioning, you know how hard it is to ask for that help. And then you know, you're mentioning people who almost kind of anticipate your needs to and that those are different types of people. There's different categories, different capacities, people show up for you in your life, depending on their relationship with you the proximity to whatever it might be. But I think one of the overarching reasons people don't want to ask for help is it's beyond just feeling that they might seem weak. It's also the idea that you don't want to have to have a debt to someone. I think people are always worried that it's tit for tat, if I'm going to ask for help than that, I'm going to owe that person something. And they're going to be sitting there waiting until I pay that debt back. And that's a really hard way to live thinking that.

Tanya Tringali

Yeah, you know, that's a really, really interesting point. And one way in which I feel like the aging process is teaching me that that's not a true statement. Right as I can now at this point in my life, and my mid 40s, look back and think about earlier times in my life, when I had older friends who really took care of me in a very particular kind of way. And now that I'm getting older, I do have some friends that are younger than me. And I have stepped in to take care of them in a similar way. And so I'm not giving back to the people who gave to me, per se, but I'm giving in a way that I learned from other people who were older than me how to give to the next generation, let's say, and, and, and you feel that rhythm of life happened in that way. So maybe people can let go of some of that angst or fear, if they just think about that circle of life, that larger circle.

Florence Ann

But I think that's also a really important point about how you are helping the next generation or the people younger than you learn how to take care of one another. And that's an important piece as well. Because I say this in the book, you know, you can't expect people to be what you want them to be you can't you have to accept them for who they are, where they are in their life, not where you want them to be not where you think they should be. And relationships, whether romantic, platonic, whatever it is, it's all kind of the same rules. You know, there's an energy that you know, brings you to a person there's a chemistry there's all of that exists in friendships too. And there's a reason you decide to be friends with the person you decide to have someone in your life but I think we also kind of like wax poetic, you know, poetic about this idea that you know, friendships and love and all of it is all just you know, hugs and flowers and gumdrops, but there's a lot of work that goes into through these relationships, and what happens when it's not perfect when it's a lot less than perfect when I talk about the village burning down, when the village is lost, the village is lost for a lot of different reasons, falling outs, breakups, divorce, death, things like that, those things are just as important for us to concentrate on. As the rest of the stuff is when it's all positive. When you're looking for that support in your life, we have to look at the whole picture. Because life isn't fair, life isnt perfect. We don't live in a Nirvana, you know. So I don't pretend that the work that we do in this relationship building is supposed to lead you to this holy grail. And it's this perfect plan. It's this perfect roadmap, it's going to be messy, and things in your life are not going to go according to plan. But the whole point is, there should always be a place for you to come back home to where you can figure out where can I take control in my life where I feel like I've lost control. That's what hopefully building your village does for you is no matter what age you are, season are you are in your life, that you have a place you can come back to and work these steps and know that you can take control and find connection and figure this out for yourself. And I think that's important.

Tanya Tringali

So on that note, when you say work these steps, I was just thinking about how your book is intended to be a bit of a, I'm gonna say two things a how to book, but also a, it's about deep introspection, because yeah, it's not just like step one, ask for help, step two, it wouldn't be a book if it was that simple. But it's about like, what why do we have the barriers to these seemingly simple steps? So let's back it up a bit. Because, of course, I have a bad habit of just diving right in, which is what I did with you.

Florence Ann

I do too. I do too.

Tanya Tringali

But now I'm like, wait a minute, the listeners are probably going or I'm not sure how we got there. So take us to the beginning, say somebody is, at whatever stage of life it is that they're realizing that they've got this empty space that that really needs a village? What is the first step? And how do they roll this out kind of a little bit more practically speaking.

Florence Ann

So I give a lot of different examples from my own life in the book and other people's lives in the book. You know, I talk about some very trying times for me, I froze my eggs when I was 35 and went through IVF and did all of that. And, you know, that took a toll on me emotionally and physically. And it changed how I was showing up for people, it changed how I was behaving and other people's villages. And it changed who I needed in mind. So I give a lot of examples about you know, real life situations. But one of the first things I think that people should do when they don't know what to do first, they know that there are gaps, they know that there are voids. And I'm going to use an example, for a very good friend of mine, one of my best friends, she moved to Texas, about a year and a half ago, knew not a soul there, she moved for her husband's job her two kids. And she was terrified, absolutely terrified to do it. Because she did not know how she was going to start over. She was part of a huge family here an enormous support system, all of her girlfriends. And this was basically her worst fear. And so we talked a lot about it. But I said to her, okay, you know, reasonably you're going to meet people through your kids, because your kids are going to be in school, they're going to be in daycares and things like that you'll meet other parents, but what about you? Like what's going to satiate you? How are you going to invent yourself or reinvent yourself there. And so I started talking to her about philanthropy. And I really believe that this is a great first step for people out there who move to a new city or need to meet new people and don't necessarily know how to do it, start looking in your community at things that interest you in terms of charity or giving back and do that research. Because once you go and you have that first meeting or you go to an event, and you start to meet like minded people have similar values to to you that your hearts beat for the same reason, same cause you're going to start to grow your community, you're going to meet new people, but you're also going to do something that's important to you two birds with one stone in that way. But that is a safe way, I would say a seemingly safe way, an easier way to go and put yourself out there because you're going to be in a place that feels comfortable for you. Because you're all there for for a reason. So that's my first piece of advice for people out there who are looking for that first step. That's a nice first step to make.

Tanya Tringali

Yeah, I think that that can be looked at really broadly depending on what's going on in one's life. So I can imagine that perhaps the idea of going to certain kinds of groups could feel overwhelming to some personality types. But again, it's no different than when I talked to moms about needing to find other moms with other kids. So usually, I've talked about this a few times on the show, but just for the sake of this conversation, when the work I do with people is fading out, oftentimes around 12 weeks postpartum, I'm like, Okay, now you don't what you what you don't need any more is like a health care provider and therapist kind of in the mix, you've got to find your village, because they need to fill this void. Because I haven't had to talk about poopy diapers for 23 years. And I'm not going to keep talking about poopy diapers with you, you've got to find people who are dealing with poopy diapers, right? Like, they are your people.

Florence Ann

Right? The people that are in that similar stage of life as you Yeah, so

Tanya Tringali

it can be as simple as a moms group, it can be as simple as going to the park. And other ways it can be find your exercise groove and young people there. It might not be, you know, the meetups that are more in the realm of business and all of the other things, which I think will come for many people in time, right when they can find their inner interests again, right.

Florence Ann

Yeah. But you know what, there's a season for it. Right. You know, right now, the poop. The poopy diaper season is that season, and you need to find people that can relate to what you're going through. Because no matter what I think one thing we all want, no matter our age, race, creed, background, anything we all want to be seen, heard and understood. So you know, figure out what that means to you in that moment of your life. And, you know, you're talking about something that is very specific. But you know, a friend of mine the other day, she just had her second baby. And she's, oh, gosh, she's about a month little over a month postpartum. And she was saying, she feels like, she's in this fog, that she remembers, like going through this with her daughter, you know, a few years ago, but, and she's very happy, but also questioning everything again, and questioning herself and second guessing and third guessing. And, you know, once the visits stop from the people that want to see the new baby, and once and you know, the meal, train ends and all of that, and you're left, you know, surviving, and that's basically what she tells me all the time. She feels like she's just surviving. I said to her, then what does help look like for you right now? If that's how you feel? What can I do to help? What do you need right now? And, you know, there's I think there's a very specific transition that we're kind of alluding to here right now. That happens after the the newness and the shininess of that new baby. You and then you're left you know, living your life. And surviving is the key word here. And how does your village show up for you? And then also, What's hard is someone like her who is a people pleaser. Feels bad, because she thinks she's not being a very good friend. And she's just all caught up in herself right now. Yeah. And she's feeling guilty about that amidst everything else that she's dealing with. So there's a lot there's a lot of combative, you know, combative, you know, combative with internally, combative feelings, conflicting feelings, and that can be very difficult to navigate alone, certainly. And even worse, if you're not if you don't feel like you have a place that you can talk about it.

Tanya Tringali

Okay, so let's assume that people have found their way to start accessing community members

Florence Ann

Yeah.

Tanya Tringali

how do I say this? It is it important to know what you are capable of? And then not cast the members of what you think you are good at yourself? Or is it the case that regardless of what you think you're good at you deserve another person to fill that role for you rather than you having less cast members so to speak, and trying to do more yourself? I don't know if I just said that.

Florence Ann

No, I think I'm tracking so you know, it is this quality versus quantity situation you know, I am not telling you to go out there and you know, get 100 friends because that's gonna make you happy. Some of the people I know in my life who are extremely busy have you know a cobweb of you know, calendar to deal with. They're some of the loneliest people I know too. So quantity does not necessarily equate to happiness here. It is the quality of those friendships. I think as we get older, we realize that you know, you care less about what people think of you you care less you know about, you know, pleasing people. And you also know that, you know, collecting friends like you would not, you know, like, you know, like cards and iconology cards, that's not what you're supposed to be doing. So, going back to this idea of, you know, casting the people that you need in your life, you can have more than one of these villagers, you may have six accepting villagers you may have, you know, whatever it may be, you know it that that amount can can vary. But knowing thyself is very important, knowing what you're not capable of. And to go back to my IVF example, when I was going through that. And I would like to think that I'm probably all six of those villagers, but I'm not all six to every single person in my life, it depends on the person. I know, at that time when I was going through IVF, that I was absolutely incapable of being the organizer, villager. And that's something I can usually do. I can organize the social things and the meetups and the dinners and the walks and this and that, at that time, I wanted nothing to do with it. I just wanted people to kind of leave me alone, I wanted to do my own thing, I wanted to be in my bubble. So I was no longer operating in that capacity for people. And I know that friends and family felt me pull back in that way. And there probably was some sort of void there because someone wasn't doing the social wasn't making the social arrangements like they were used to, they counted on me to be the one that kind of orchestrated a lot of things to get people together. Now, they had to do that on their own, because I wanted to pull back. And so I was very honest with people at that time, saying I just was not capable of giving more than I was at that point. And try not to apologize for it, though I did, because I just can't help myself. I felt bad about that. And of course, they were good friends and said, you know, please don't feel like you have to apologize. Thank you for being honest about it. But I had people stepping in at my life at that time, then that were filling villager roles that I hadn't needed in a long time or ever, I really never needed a, I get it. What's the best way to say this, I suppose. I usually was the dependable one. So then all of a sudden, the dependable villagers were kind of coming to me, I was delegating a lot of different things to people. And normally, I was very happy to be the one who was kind of taking charge. And so I didn't ever really realize different friends of mine were actually dependable villagers until they started showing up that way in my life. And so it was almost refreshing to see that I had, I was now seeing my friends and family in a different way, in a different light. I didn't realize they had certain qualities that they had. And I was like, gosh, this is amazing. I have to honor this. And that because this is this is new. They're teaching me something about what I needed teaching me something about them. And I think they learned something about themselves through it. So that's a very long winded way. And hopefully, I answered your questions there about how these roles can change and they ebb and they flow and they permeate and depending on the time in your life, you are going to be able to do things and not able to do things and that's okay. But again, the common denominator here is being honest about what you can and cannot do and what you do and do not need.

Tanya Tringali

Did you know that less than 15% of people meet guidelines for recommended amounts of physical activity during pregnancy. As healthcare providers, it is our duty to promote health and wellness throughout the lifespan and the perinatal period is all too often overlooked. Our clients look to us for guidance on this, and we do the best we can with the knowledge we have. But that's often based on a combination of life experiences, common sense and myths. My new course exercise in the perinatal period for health care providers is designed for providers who are motivated to improve their ability to support their clients in getting or staying active throughout the perinatal period, including their postpartum return to fitness. Click the link in the show notes to learn more. Are you pregnant or a new parent looking to ensure a better postpartum experience? Or are you a birth worker looking to improve your postpartum care skills? Check out thriving after birth, an online self paced course by me midwife and educator Tanya Tringali. It's 10 and a half hours of video content featuring experts in lactation mental health, pelvic floor health, pediatric sleep issues, you also get worksheets and a workbook as well as options to have a one on one session with me sign up and Motherwitmaternity.com/thriving And let's improve postpartum care together.

Tanya Tringali

I think in your book you talk about kind of miscasting people I don't know why I've sort of put this twist on it like it's a play. But...

Florence Ann

that's exactly it though yes, it. You are casting it like a play or a movie. These are the main characters in your life. That's exactly what you're doing.

Tanya Tringali

So I think in your book you talked about when you cast a character correctly. So I what I'm hearing, though, is, okay, there are times when the person cast in a certain role isn't living up to their expectations, and we make space for that. But how do we know whether we asked someone to play a part that they're not capable of?

Florence Ann

There's, you know, we always talk, laugh about like, firing your friends, like somebody, like they read by they read the book, and they were like, I gotta fire some of these friends. That's what I realized after reading your book, and I started laughing. And I said, you know, I, you know, you say it in a funny way, but it's actually truthful. You know, sometimes, you do need to fire people from certain positions. And sometimes people fire themselves, it just kind of, you know, just kind of fades away, you know, relationships, you know, that happens in relationships, too. But the point of the incorrectly casting people, sometimes you need to look at your cast of characters and realize that you need to shuffle the deck, or you need to recast in some sort of way. Or you need to realize that you were putting expectations on people that were unfair. And what I mean by that is, you know, you might be looking to one of your friends to be your healer, but they don't have the skill set to do that. But you've you and their, your mind, have set them up to be your healer, and they keep failing you over and over again, and they're letting you down. And it's ruining the relationship. But because you have expectations on this person that are not appropriate, it's not playing to their skill set. So instead of them being your healer, maybe they're the organizer, maybe they're the dependable one, maybe they're the accepting one. So recast them in a role that's going to set them up for success. Again, it's not about what I want you to be, it's me, accepting who you are, and where you are in your life. And, and going forward in that way and building the relationships in that way. It's, it's not fair for us and to put expectations on people. And that's across the board. I think that's why we get so much trouble in relationships is you expect people to read your mind, expect them to just know what you need. And you don't advocate for yourself, you know, how many times do you hear that in romantic relationships? So they're like, You should just know, you should just know what I need or just know what I want. It's not fair.

Tanya Tringali

Right? Oh, absolutely. It's the death of many, many, many marriages and romantic relationships. Totally agree. Right. So this is sounding like it's a budding the idea of boundaries.

Florence Ann

Yes. Boundaries, the dirty word, isn't it?

Tanya Tringali

We get asked, we may get asked to fill a role that we can't fulfill, right? We feel guilty, and we say yeah, anyway, and then we fail, and we beat ourselves up, and then we let the other person down. And it's a vicious cycle. And we keep beating ourselves up for it. So it seems like it's a two way street, right? We have we are asking people to be a part of our community, but we also have to be honest about what we can do.

Florence Ann

Yes, and you in terms of boundaries, you know, I've been used the accepting villager as an example because someone was just talking to me about this idea of, okay, the accepting villager definition that I give in the book is the non judgmental one and your life, the one you can confide and the one you can tell your secrets to. Okay, let's use that as a definition here of the accepting villager. Can you be an accepting villager with someone that you don't necessarily have a deep relationship with, there's a boundary that you have with a person in your life. And, and I, I caution people to, to not get caught up in these definitions. So by the book, you know, you know, you have to also live your life according to what works for you your value system, you know, what, you know, what your definitions of things are to these, these, these definitions are malleable. But can you be an accepting villager to someone that you have a surface relationship with, because you've put that boundary there. And this is something I actually have in my own life, some of my own life. I accept them for who they are. flaws and all. And they're someone that they're a family member, they have to be in my life in some sort of way. But I know that I don't feel safe in that relationship to tell that person my deepest, darkest secrets, but I have created that boundary where we just don't go that deep. But I accept that that is that that's who that person is. And that those are the limitations. And so that's an example I want to give people. And hopefully it was, it was a positive example for people to know that there can be different levels of, of boundaries that you have within all six of these archetypes, depending on the person and depending on the relationship you have to have with that person. Because, you know, it's easy to say I don't want to be around people that are toxic, I don't want to be, sometimes we don't get to make that choice. So we have to figure out boundaries, so that we can stay safe in those relationships and in our environments. So all of that applies here too to those six archetypes as well. It's creating those boundaries and applying them where necessary and unnecessary to how you need them to be.

Tanya Tringali

This comes up so often in the work I do with people in that during the the last week, few weeks of pregnancy, we're often preparing as best we can for postpartum. And so much of that is asking yourself the hard questions about who have you already invited into your space during this time? And, you know, how are you feeling about that, because usually, by the time I start working with people, people are already feeling really anxious about a small number of people that have kind of interjected themselves into the situation, or that they felt they couldn't say no to right. And so we kind of break down all the options, whether that be the most extreme version, which is let's not have them come, which doesn't happen very often. But once in a blue moon, all the way to how can we kind of fit them into what they're capable of. So it's interesting to hear you saying this, and we're yet we're thinking about life outside and well beyond this. And it's the same exact skill sets the same set, it's the same conversation, that for the people who I've done this with anyway, I think they can really relate. And hopefully what's happening is they're continuing to do this with themselves, onward in their lives, what is this person capable of, so that it they don't have to feel let down, I don't have to feel let down so that we don't create kind of a clash. And just taking that skill into the future of your life, everything you just said to me made perfect sense. It's just that I see it through the lens of this, you know, narrow, very, very deeply transitional time in life. But yeah, we have all these transitions in life. And I can see how this logic holds throughout. Lately, I've even been thinking about the aging process, and moving into later life. I like many of my listeners, I'm sure are having loved ones getting very old and watching that transition happen. And I think we see that loneliness creep back in. And I think that's something we all have to get ahead of.

Florence Ann

Right? Yes, we use because you don't want to be that person that doesn't have anyone, right when you're older. And we've we've all been there. I mean, in high school, oh my gosh, I one of the the volunteer opportunities that I had was at an elderly home. And I remember walking down the halls and, you know, never seen visitors, you know, with any some of these people, and it just breaks my heart and make me cry right now even thinking about it. I mean, I grew up in an old fashioned old school Italian family. It was a multi generational home, my grandparents lived with us, it was the best. And I used to be the one that stayed in the hospital whenever they would have to go to the hospital. I mean, that wasn't the best but that being in the hospital, but I would be the one with them. I'd stay overnight and do all that. And the same thing. I'd walk the halls and I would see people in those hospital rooms never having anyone there no one with them. And we never left my nan our Papa alone a second. You know, so it was we were lucky, of course. But what about the people that aren't lucky like that. And that's going back to what I said in the beginning is no matter what you were born into, if you weren't born into a situation like I was that you had tons of cousins and extended family around all the time, but you want a family tree, but you want community, you want a village you want people then I want people to feel empowered to do that. I want you to feel like no matter what you deserve to have that and you can create it for yourself. But like you're saying, as we get older and our mortality comes into you no question and we wonder what our life is going to look like when we're older and who's going to be around us. That's why this work is so important because you are setting yourself up in the future for hopefully a rich and meaningful life in whatever way that that is for you in terms of connection.

Tanya Tringali

Yeah, and just to put to get back to the present moment for most people I hadn't until we kind of got to this part of the conversation, thought about casting members who are in our older generation, so our parents generation up to potentially grandparents or great aunts, and uncles. But there's such a richness there. One of my cousin's right now her. Her youngest child, is I think about eight. And she's recently started having her father do childcare on Wednesdays after school. And the stories of the eight year old and the 70 year old bondage have been like blowing my mind. And it's just beautiful. And I think we're really, that's, that's something we've lost in modern times, with the moving away from families and all of that, but I haven't really thought about what it means to cast those people into these roles, as well.

Florence Ann

And I love that perspective. You know, I think it sounds like you were had a similar, you know, family dynamic, perhaps as mine, where you had a lot of cousins are you had, you know, at least extended family around. And the truth is, you know, you look back in time, and we aren't supposed to do life alone, you know, there were villages for a reason people did raise their children together in these villages, and there was something very special about that. And, you know, we have to be able to take the old school and new school and make some sort of hybrid there. And I do think we are losing the appeal and losing the sacredness of those multi generational relationships. I know I'm a very different person, because of the environment that I was raised in. You know, I always tell this is a, I guess, a little tip from me to you, for anyone who does have older people in your family or in your friendship circle, you know, take your phone out and record them telling stories. Because believe me, you are going to want it I can't tell you how often we watch old movies and old videos of Nana, Papa Telling stories and things like that you want it and you think you'll remember and you don't you don't remember. So you know, putting an emphasis on what you're saying right now, these these multi generational relationships? And what can we learn from our elders, and you know, seeing the relationship between a seven year old and an eight year old and the kind of the magic that happens there as they both are looking through the world through their own lenses, but also teaching each other things too. It's really, it's really incredible. And I think that also, you know, begs the question of, you know, how are we being good students in life, you know, are how, who are we learning from, you know, who are we? Are we are we creating space for in our lives? And what are what what gifts? Are they giving us? What are they learning? How are they watering us all of that. Because work I always say, and I talk about this in the book, being kind of a mosaic inside of you, this collection of people and experiences that you kind of pull from in your life, I go into this mosaic, in my in my heart, I would say, you know, when I pull out these different things that I've learned from different people, some of it is not always positive, but I've learned something from it. And that's part of the mosaic too. So I love what you're saying, I love that you're saying that we need to think about not just our counterparts, people that are our age, you know, who are all the different teachers in our lives?

Tanya Tringali

Yeah. Well, I mean, I think one of the last things I would love to touch on here is in kind of sticking with this line of logic here, where we're talking about modern life, and the ways in which having a village and a community has changed. It's not just inherent anymore, and we have to really build it. I also was thinking about, as I was reading through parts of your book, I was thinking about how for many of us, I think we have multiple communities that we feel beholden to, and that that can become its own stressor as well. Because we can be and I think you were just saying something along these lines, different. We are a different person to each person that we are part of a community with. And we have communities that may be overlap like little Venn diagrams, but they're not all one. And you can feel a little almost frantic. Who am I to this group? Who am I to that group? Am I holding up my end of the bargain in this group? And now I can't do it for this group. So I think we can take on too much. Right? Even when we're in a place where we feel like we haven't even filled every role in our own circle, right. So how to navigate that.

Florence Ann

While I also think it's it's about people also managing the expectation about what it looks like to show up for people, what are these gestures that we're talking about? In the book I have? What are gut checks and action steps, the gut checks are what did I learn in this? Obviously, from this chapter, and then the action steps are what can I do today? Not tomorrow, not a month from now, not six years from now, what can I actually do today to, to put all this into action, because like I said, before, we've all read those books are like, this is way too difficult, I don't want to do any of this, I want you to feel like this is doable, it's not such a heavy lift. So the idea that everything has to be big, everything has to be showy. Everything has to be an enormous gesture, or an enormous expression of love. In order for it to be meaningful or valuable, I want to get rid of that idea. That it it's so much smaller than that in life, oftentimes, it is the small things that lead to big results. And so the example I want to give here is if you feel like I, you know, I have all these different communities, I have all these subgroups, these secondary villages that I'm a part of, and am I doing a good job, you know, we're gonna make ourselves crazy if we sit around all day wondering if we're actually being a good friend, or a good husband, or a good wife, or a good girlfriend, or you know, all of that. I mean, we could make ourselves absolutely nuts doing that evaluation on a day to day basis. And that's a rabbit hole, no one wants to go down. But if you can start to think about what are the things I can do today to again, go back to make people feel seen, heard and understood something small, to remind people that you matter, that they're seen that they're they're not invisible, especially with the mental health crisis in our world that it is today, I always say, take out your phone, you're on it anyway, take out your phone, look at your text messages. And I always keep Text Message Threads open for certain people that maybe I don't talk to very often, or I've talked to recently that I know is going through a hard time I scroll through, I see you know who I need to check in on, I send one simple text message that says wellness check with an exclamation point. Because I always have to use some sort of emojis or exclamation points. And that is the signal to that person that when they're ready, tell me how you're doing. And they can get back to me the next day, or whatever it is. But it's me popping it in that moment, just letting them know that they're not forgotten, and that I'm here if they need me when they're ready. And that's a small thing you can do very easy scrolling through your phone, send a few of those text messages out and let the person reach back when they're ready. It's a small gesture. But my goodness, can I tell you when someone texts me on a day where I'm just it's particularly bad, or whatever's going on, and I'll get a text that says it just popped in my mind just wants you to know that I love you, or I'm proud of you, or whatever it is. And you're like, how did you know that I needed this today. And you know what, you have to follow those instincts and those and those kind of intuition, you know, kind of bred moments. But that's just a small example of something you can do. And also, you know, again, you're on your phone all the time, putting your phone in your calendar, a reminder to also remind you to call someone when you're in the car tomorrow on your way to a meeting when you have 10 minutes or something like that, and you leave a voicemail, whatever it is, do something like that. Yeah.

Tanya Tringali

That really, that really spoke to me, because I think I've heard from enough people that they feel that they've dropped some big balls. And I think the balls get dropped, because they set their own bar too high. Bingo. And I I'm really piecing that together now. And yeah, these small gestures really do go a long way. It took me a little while to make this transition. It sounds a little neurotic. But I outright schedule time in my Google Calendar with friends when somebody texts and says, can you talk I'm like, I have time. Next week. Let's put something on the calendar. And then we sit down and have a proper video chat that's scheduled. And I'm actually making the time for it rather than trying to squeeze it in at a time that maybe wasn't totally right. But I wanted to take advantage of every free moment. It's felt much more intentional and a lot less stressful. And that's really worked for me to keep in touch with people.

Florence Ann

And I love that again, it's what works for you and like you said it's it's it's making you also feel like you are also showing up in the ways that mean something to you because we also want to make our ourselves proud when we go to sleep at night. We want to know that we did a good job that day. We all want that validation the same way we want to give it to other people. So figuring out what that means, again, it's small things. It also could be big gestures to it that happens. There's times in your life where you're going to be that person And that does do that big gesture or whatever it might be. But again, it's about figuring out how you can do this in your life. And it can be consistent, it can become a practice. And that is what this is to. It is a practice, just like anything in life that is worth it, it is going to take effort. But the intensity of that effort is not always going to be the same. Some days, just like in life, we always tell people, what do they always say about is their actual balance in life that you know, you know that and moms talk about that all the time. And I always say that it's not about living necessarily a balanced life in this like holistic way, it's a day to day thing, some days are going to be more balanced than others. Some days, you're going to be a better wife than you are a daughter that day or a better friend than you are a spouse, whatever it is. That's I think the secret sauce to it all is evaluating yourself on a daily basis like that and thinking what are you know, where did I when? And where am I going to work on more tomorrow? And that, that that's what it should be? Stop putting so much pressure on ourselves? Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Tanya Tringali

Anything else that you really want to add that I maybe veered off off path? Oh, god, it's like essential to get out there about your book.

Florence Ann

No, I am just happy to have had this space with you. And for those of you that are listening, you know if the first step for you is connecting with me, because you need someone to reach out to to talk to about this stuff, and you don't know what to do. I'm here, I'm your virtual village. And that way you can reach out to me whether you send me an email, or you go to my website, or you follow me on social or whatever it might be, if, if that's the first step you need, I answer every DM. So please don't feel like you can't reach out.

Tanya Tringali

Yeah, share your Instagram, because I will say I love what you do on Instagram, it's very particular, you're not trying to fit into the mold of what everybody else is doing. You know, like when the latest dance song or meme comes around. And everybody does that same post, you don't do that. And I really appreciate that. You're kind of like looking at the camera straight. And you're talking about something that's very real. And I think that for our families that are growing and aging and our healthcare providers who are who are dealing with their professional life up against their personal life, some of the things that I've heard you talk about are really poignant. I think people can really appreciate that and get little snippets of inspiration. So sharing on Instagram.

Florence Ann

Yeah, so FlorenceAnnRomano is Facebook, Instagram, you could just go there and find me or Florida dan.com. I also have blogs and all sorts of things in a newsletter if you're interested in any of that too. But truthfully, just connect with me. And like thank you for saying that. I don't like to do the trendy stuff. I like to just keep it real. And I just care more about the connection than all that. So I'm here for you, whatever you might need. I really am

Tanya Tringali

Awesome. I'll make sure all your details are in the show notes. Anything else you want to pop in there, you just let me know.

Florence Ann

Thank you. This has been so joyful. I appreciate you so much.

Tanya Tringali

Thank you for listening to the mother whip podcast. If any of the issues we discussed today resonate with you or your experience, I'd love to hear from you. Leave me a voicemail at 917-310-0573 Or better yet, email me a voice memo at Tanya at Mother wit maternity.com. I really want to hear what worked for you what didn't work, what support you'd wish you had, how you got through the tough times how you advocated for yourself, or especially any tips you want to share with our listeners. I want to hear all of it. And if you'd really like to work together, you can get a discount on your first consultation with me at Mother wit maternity.com using the code firstconsult10%off. That's one 0 % symbol, all one word. Okay, that's all. That's wonderful being in community with you all. Thanks again for listening and see you next time.

Carolina

And remember, listeners, nothing we discussed on this show should ever be considered medical advice. Please speak to your local provider about anything that comes up in this show that resonates with you and your needs and your health care.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai